Episode 70: The Retreat Boom: Entrepreneurial Therapists [featuring Jennifer Agee]

Show Notes

Do you ever think that, even though you might love being a therapist, there is another calling out there or a way to take your therapeutic skills and give back to the world?

Do you ever feel stagnant in your career and wish you could rekindle your passion or shift it to something related but better for you?

Have you ever wanted to get away, travel someplace new, have an adventure, and experience the world in a raw and authentic way without having to take time from your busy schedule to make plans or figure out what that kind of experience looks like?

Well, this episode is for you

In this episode, I talk with Jennifer Agee, therapist, strategic business coach, retreat host, founder and owner of Counseling Community, Inc., and host of the "Sh*t You Wish You Learned in Grad School" podcast.

Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:

1. Understand the power behind therapist entrepreneurial retreats and how it opens doors to new possibilities in unexpected ways.
2. Learn what stepping out of your comfort zone can do for your personal and professional growth.
3. Understand the ways retreats shape and shift therapists’ careers to create more profitable and fulfilling opportunities.

So, if you are ready to have your adventure and walk a different path to lead you to your calling, then retreats might be the thing for you. It’s amazing how much they can impact lives, as well as the extreme amount of growth that comes from being in an incubator of like-minded professionals.

Listen to the experiences of two retreat hosts who are deep in the therapist entrepreneurial retreat and travel world. And who knows, maybe you’ll want to attend one in the future or even create your own.

More about Jennifer:

Jennifer Agee, LCPC is a Strategic Business Coach leading retreats in the US and internationally providing entrepreneurs the tools they need to succeed. She is the founder of Counseling Community, Inc. and the host of the podcast “Sh*t You Wish You Learned in Grad School.” Jennifer owns a group private counseling practice in Kansas City where she lives with her husband.

For the first 15 years of her career, Jennifer served as the Executive Director of two non-profit organizations working both domestically and internationally. She combines business practicality, strategy, compassion, and fun to all of her business ventures.

Jennifer's Website: counselingcommunity.com

Jennifer's Podcast: Sh*t You Wish You Learned in Grad School

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A Thanks to Our Sponsor!

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Transcript

PATRICK CASALE: Hey, everyone, you are listening to another episode of the All Things Private Practice Podcast. I'm your host, Patrick Casale, joined today by my good friend, and colleague, and now co-host, and partner in a lot of my upcoming endeavors, Jennifer Agee. And we are going to talk about the power of travel, and experience, and stepping out of your comfort zone, and the retreat boom that is happening in our industry, and all those things. So, thank you so much for making the time and coming on.

JENNIFER AGEE: Absolutely. This is one of my favorite topics. So, I'm glad we're getting to talk about it.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, mine too. And I think for both of us, you know, something we've connected over is travel and our passion for experiencing new things, and new places, and new cultures, and new foods. And I just get really excited when I start talking about this stuff. Like, there's not a time where people ask me, "What do you really love to do?" And I really have the answer. But once I started hosting retreats in Ireland last year, I was like, "Oh, that's the answer."

And I was really grateful to be a coach at your first retreat in Tennessee. And I want to just talk a little bit about why we're doing these things because I think it's so much more than just saying like, we're doing retreats because it's a wonderful moneymaker and you get to travel while doing it. Like yes, that can be true. But there is so much more to it.

JENNIFER AGEE: Absolutely. And I guess, I would also say that one of the things I think we bonded over is, we both like to go off the beaten path. So, one of the things that is important for both of us with our retreats is that we find unique spaces and places that we ourselves would want to go. Like, you know, those like, "Holy cow, how did I end up in this situation?" Kind of moments. Like, I live for that kind of stuff. Like, I don't need to go to the Applebee's of Spain, I want to go to a place where you walk away, and you've had an experience with locals, and you're like, "Holy crap, I can't believe this is my life right now." That is the stuff that really lights my internal world on fire. And really, the passion behind retreats is I want… because it's so fun for me, I want other people to get to do it too.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, I couldn't say it better myself. And although if I did find an Applebee's in Spain, I'd probably check it out just to see if it's as awful as it is here. I love finding the local things, you know, and some of my friends will make fun of me for the way I travel because they're like, "You don't travel like a tourist."

And I don't. I just feel like connecting with people who are actually involved in their communities, who own their own small businesses, who are trying to make it work for themselves and their families, and getting to see what they've created, and supporting them. I really find that to be really wonderful, and a great way to connect, and a great way to make new friends and colleagues. 

And sometimes these are relationships that even last, you know, a lifetime where you are contacting them, and calling them, or WhatsApping happening. I have a couple of those people in my life right now. And none of that would have been possible if we were like, "All right, when we go to Ireland in March we're going to stay in Dublin. And we're going to do like all the touristy stuff in Ireland."

And no, instead, I had to research for hours, and hours, and hours until I found this like, small, historic, locally forgotten village in the middle of nowhere. And it was just a wonderful experience. 

And some of those relationships with the venue hostess, and the tour guide, and the coffee shop owners are still relationships that I have today. And for me, that is what traveling experience is all about.

JENNIFER AGEE: Yeah, I'm the same way. And one of the reasons I think retreats are important for both of us is because getting that time away to be able to focus and be intentional in relationships in a new place where your brain's then lighting up because you're having new experiences, it engages your creative mind. 

And I found that a lot of my growth has come from going to retreats, or conferences, or summits where I'm sitting around the table with people that I normally wouldn't ever be in my life. And I'm having interesting conversations, and it's getting my creativity going, and getting my thoughts going. It's shaking up that part of me that just gets stuck in the status quo and starts to dream of what could be and putting yourself in that intentional space and also getting a tax write-off for it. For me, it is like a winning combination of things.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, it's a perfect combination. And I've been at plenty of these conferences or retreats and I can attest that Jennifer is always at a table surrounded by people talking with everybody and I am much more introverted. So, I'm like, "I found one or two people that I've been talking to all week." Jen's like, "I've made all of these connections." 

And you're right, you know, it's a combination of travel, and getting out of your comfort zone, and stepping away from the day-to-day. And also, it's an investment in yourself. And it's scary because some of these things cost a good amount of money and to be able to put work on hold to go to something. Because ultimately, what I look at it as is, even in the short term, if you're spending money to get there, and to be a part of this experience, the long-term return on investment because you put yourself in an environment that's outside of your comfort zone, where you had to say no to things in your life because you had to make time for this, where you were able to make relationships with new people and get inspired by what they're doing, or their ideas, or their feedback, to have these experiences that you're going to hold on to forever. And I think that is unbelievably powerful, unbelievably transformative. 

And there are things that you will experience that you are going to reference back to and reflect back to and use, sometimes when you're struggling as a resource to say, "Wow, I remember when I felt this way, in this place, with these people, eating this food, experiencing this thing." It's just that transformation immediately back to that time. And that is so, so unbelievably powerful, and just really positive. And you can't get that if you don't step outside of your comfort zone, though.

JENNIFER AGEE: I completely agree. The other thing I've noticed is from my retreats, the relationships that are formed between people is really beautiful. Like, genuine friendships, mastermind groups, all sorts of ways that people support each other come from this because you're in this incubator-type environment where you get to really know people, get to see their personality style, what they're passionate about, how both of your passions can maybe benefit one another in some sort of business context. 

And there are just things that get formed because you are in an incubator that simply cannot take place outside of that incubator. You could only go so far just on social media, right? You need those real experiences with people where you're just sitting there and having conversations, drinking coffee in the morning when you're in your jammies, and you're all staying in the same house or whatever. Just the intimacy that gets created out of these is really cool. 

I was talking to some of the people that came to my retreat in Cabo. And there are two different mastermind groups that have gotten formed from that, that I know of right now. And hearing what they're doing is inspiring the shit out of me, just for making me want to continue to do these things and create this kind of space for people because they're really encouraging each other. And it's empowering to have other people stand behind you and say, like, "You can do it." Or "Have you thought about this?" Amazing. It's yeah, positive, positive.

PATRICK CASALE: It is amazing. And you know, these relationships get formed because, you know, we so often think about, we need CEUs, we need training. And we go to these trainings, and they're boring, and they're grueling, and it's just slideshow after slideshow, and you're just trying to get through the damn day so you can get your CEUs and go home or go back to your hotel room. 

But to be able to be immersed in, like you said, a small incubator, where you're around like-minded people. And maybe someone is doing the exact same thing as you but doing it differently. And you're picking each other's brains about, "Oh, I tried this, it didn't work." "Oh, but have you tried it this way?" Or, "Have you considered this option?" 

And it's just really wonderful because that energy is kinetic. And it's like, we always talk about iron sharpens iron. And like, if you surround yourself with people who are doing things and helping you grow, it's going to help you step outside your comfort zone even though you're still scared to do so because you know that you have these people who are in your corner, rooting you on, offering you advice, supporting your ideas.

And our mastermind got formed in that way. And I think it's really crucial for everyone to have a group where they can connect, and bounce ideas off one another, and offer feedback, and critique in a way that's positive. And supporting each other's growth, knowing like, we can all be doing these things and be successful, and we don't have to, like, cut each other down or, you know, be envious, or jealous, or insecure about the other. And it's just a really wonderful thing to witness. 

And the thing that lights me up is like when we were in Ireland, there were a couple of moments, but one of these moments was just so spontaneous. And it was the moment when our tour guide took us off the beaten path onto that secluded Irish beach and like, we made those Irish coffees, and those whiskies, and then they were teaching everyone hurling on the beach, and I was just looking around everyone's faces and it was just pure, unadulterated joy. 

And I was thinking to myself, I was like, "This is one of those moments that I know I will remember for the rest of my life." And I am quite sure that a lot of other people on that beach were feeling the same way. 

And you never would get that if you weren't able to step outside of your comfort zone and say, I'm going to go on this experience where I don't know anybody. A lot of people didn't even know me as the host, they just maybe heard of me from here and there, and I'm going to invest resources into this, get to a different country, go on this event, be around people that I don't know for five days. And it was really, really wonderful.

JENNIFER AGEE: Yeah. I was there. It was wonderful. And I will say one of my favorite pictures of me of just having fun was on that beach with me hurling. I look like an absolute buffoon. But I was having the best dang time. And yeah, we were making Irish coffees out of the back of somebody's car with a little propane tank on the beach. And it was absolutely amazing. 

Again, that's the off-the-beaten-path stuff kind of that I was talking about, those moments that you walk away with where we're like going to a parade in Ireland on St. Patrick's Day, amazing. Having this weird, random shit happen on a beach in Ireland, that is priceless. You know, that's the stuff that really sticks in your brain.

PATRICK CASALE: I agree. And it's so hard to be able to have experiences like that if you can't form well as a group, too. Like, there's enough of letting your guard down to be able to run on the beach and look, to use your words, like a buffoon, running down the beach hurling, and it's amazing when people start to connect that way because they're growing together. And you're seeing a lot of vulnerability, a lot of insecurity, a lot of perfectionism, a lot of imposter syndrome, a lot of fearfulness being talked about in those coaching groups, and those small discussions, and those training sessions. 

And then everyone starts to form, and the group starts to get each other's backs, and everyone starts to lift each other up. And you may share something really vulnerable. And someone in the moment may offer support, or feedback, or applaud you for your courage, or come up to you after and check in with you about how you're doing. And then those relationships solidify as positive connections that you are going to hold on to for the rest of your life. 

And for me, before COVID hit, I've talked about this, I wanted to become a travel coach. I don't think it's a thing. But I wanted it to be a thing, where I helped helpers step away from their businesses and travel, have local experiences, immerse themselves in culture, get away from the nine-to-five because helpers, traditionally and notoriously, are not good at practicing what they preach, right? Like, it's like self-care, self-care, self-care, but I don't do it, I just tell people that it's a good thing that they should be doing. 

And then COVID hit and I pivoted to private practice coaching. And, you know, the rest has been history for two years. But really, that was the passion because I know how powerful it is to do that. And to go into a small pub in Ireland and just talk to the locals or like, get to know the person who's trying to get their coffee shop off the ground and just follow them on Instagram. Like, those are the things for me that are so inspiring long term because you can circle back to those connections and say, like, "Holy shit, that was incredible." 

And I don't think you can put a price on that because you almost can't force those types of things, you just have to be open to them and be curious. And being curious allows you to just kind of go deeper than just staying above the surface.

JENNIFER AGEE: And I think there's something really powerful too in having a group that are all therapists because I think there's an instant level of trust, maybe not deep trust, but there's at least a surface level of trust, where I'm willing to usually be a little more vulnerable, a little more honest, I'm willing to, you know, go to a pub with you and have drinks, even though I don't really know you, yet. 

You know, there's a little hack that allows you to go into those situations because we are all therapists. And I think there's something really powerful in sitting in space with other people because we work in 15-minute increments of time. 

And even though you may be in an office with a huge group practice, you probably don't hardly talk to anyone all day other than, "Hi." Because you write your notes, you pee, and then you got to get back to it again. 

And so, it's like an illusion of connection without really being connected. Whereas, again, going into these incubator-type environments, you get to actually connect, have the conversations you want to, be curious about things. It's a really beautiful space that gets created out of that, I think because we do have that shortcut because we are all mental health professionals.

PATRICK CASALE: True, very true. And the vulnerability that exists is real. You know, the vulnerability in showing up. I'm thinking about one of the attendees in Ireland who had just graduated from grad school and was like, "I'm going to go to this retreat. And I'm going to do this for me because I'm proud of my accomplishment." And you know, not in business yet, not in private practice yet, doesn't even know if they want to go into private practice, but willing to try something like that out. I thought that was really cool. 

And I do think you're right, there's a shortcut to saying like, we know the icebreakers, and the connection, routine, and all that fun stuff. And then, you know, when you do check-ins with therapists you got to brace for a two-hour event. So, it's one of those things where we don't often get to talk about ourselves very often because of the nature of the work that we do. 

And I think it's really wonderful to go into these events as a host and a participant, to look around the room throughout the duration of the time, and to see the groups and the friendships forming, the people going off to go do things together, the people spending time together, picking each other's brains, and it always happens. There's little groups that form, and little cliques that form, and they stay friends long term. And it's just really, really cool to witness.

And, you know I keep circling back to the Ireland experience. For me, it was probably one of the most transformational things I've ever done in my life, to be able to host it and see it through, and I took a lot of risks in that, like never been to the venue, or been to the area even though I've been Ireland many times, never tried the food that was catered, I didn't know if the music was going to suck, tour guide could have been terrible, and everything worked out wonderfully. I don't know if I'd recommend that for all of you listening who want to host events, like, some of you are going to need more assurance that, like, things are going to be okay. But that risk was worth the reward for me. And it was just really, really wonderful. 

And the night that we had music at the venue after St. Patrick's Day, I was watching everyone in the room because you know, I was definitely not dancing. But I was watching everyone who was dancing, and everyone's smiling, and just having a good time. And you could see people's personalities really, really coming out. Could have been the Guinness, too. But you know, it was very wonderful to witness. And for me, that was just really inspiring.

JENNIFER AGEE: Yeah. And I think, you know, next year we have four retreats planned in 2023 together. And I was thinking of that off-the-beaten-path stuff. And I know you love Anthony Bourdain. And it's kind of like trying to give people the Anthony Bourdain-like experiences, but with the safety of a group of people that you feel comfortable with, which that combination together of like, I really want to do this kind of stuff that I see on TV where they land in these weird places and it seems amazing. But it's also scary as shit to do that. 

And so, having someone curate that for you, and then, have other people that are like-minded go on that journey with you, it's a way to step out of your comfort zone, but kind of safely step out of your comfort zone as well. I think, too, for a lot of people.

PATRICK CASALE: I agree, 100%. And that's what these experiences are that Jennifer and I are partnering on, it's the curation of the experience. It's like, yeah, we don't want to just serve the food, we want to go with the intentionality and find the restaurants that are locally owned and have a story behind them, and are delicious, and share meals together. 

We want to go on excursions, and tours, and experiences to places that are off the beaten path. Like, in Ireland, we went to a town that people in Ireland who live there don't even know exists. And like, the things that we're going to do in Spain, and in Portugal, and Asheville, like just doing things that locals do. I think that is so important because it gives you a true sense of the community. And it allows you to know that life is so vast and there's all this complexity, and there are all these people doing these wonderful things all throughout the world. And you never get to see that if you stick to the tourist route. 

And I understand why people do that. But I just think that it's really important. Like, the day we went ziplining at your conference in Cabo and you know, I know you didn't want to zipline upside down, I'll give you shit for that for a little while. But I mean, just going and doing things like that together out in the middle of nowhere in the jungle in Cabo. Like, that was a lot of fun and it was just a really good time to just experience life.

JENNIFER AGEE: It reminds me, you know when they say like core memory unlocked or core memory, you know, being implanted. It reminds me of those moments, you know, like seeing your face or another girl, Cherish, was with us, and you were upside down on the zipline at one point. I was most certainly not going to… I am a 48-year-old grandma. Like, I am not going upside down on the zipline. 

Yes, Patrick is showing me a picture of him upside down on the zipline he's printed out, but in my memory, like, I think about the pure joy that I saw on both of your faces, like, when you were going backwards. It made me happy. Like, I got to belly laugh. I got to feel a lot of joy and again, life in the day-to-day can be really hard, but getting away and getting time to just be playful and have fun is also important. 

I'm actually really excited. I'm a TikToker. I mean, Patrick gives me shit about it, but I am that friend that will send you TikToks. If I love you, you are going to get a TikTok from me from time to time. But I'm on travel TikTok. So, I always find these like, weird random things, and I'll send them to Patrick. I'm like, "We got to do that, we got to do that, we got to do that." I mean, the planet's big, we got a lot to explore before we die

PATRICK CASALE: The list is getting quite long. But it's exciting because, you know, I think that six or seven years ago I made a Facebook post that came up in my memories the other day that was like, I had said something about how much I love traveling and travel planning, if I could figure out a way to get paid for this that would be the dream. And that was what it was, it was definitely a pipe dream. 

For this to become a reality shows you how our skills as mental health professionals and entrepreneurs are applicable in so many different arenas outside of the therapy room. And I hope that it helps others that are listening know that it doesn't have to always be one-on-one therapy. If you want it to be, that's fantastic. But if you don't, there are a lot of options out there and ways that you can help people connect. Because that's really what I think this is about, helping people connect. I think we feel so disconnected so often, to just be able to have these experiences. 

And sadly, I think that's also why so many people have that crash afterwards of like, "Oh, I'm riding this high, I feel really good, I feel really positive. This was so inspiring. Fuck, I've got to go back to my nine-to-five or my day-to-day." And there's sadness in that, there's grief. But I think that grief is important because it allows us to know that there are those moments and those opportunities to live uninhibited. And it's really, really exciting to be able to offer.

JENNIFER AGEE: I agree. And when you mentioned, you know, that you'd written something seven years ago, I'm thinking back because I just found an article, my husband is going through this thing where he wants everything in the house, like every room, every closet, everything has to be gone through in case one day we die our kids have to go through it, and he wants the not to have to go through crap we don't need. I don't know why he's got to be in his bonnet. But we're going with it. 

And I found an article that was written about me right after I got back from South Africa because I lived there for a while. And in that article, I had written that my dream job, if I could create whatever job I wanted, it would be to take people around the world and allow them to see the behind-the-scenes of the way people lived. And I think about how that dream had been tucked in there because I just got busy doing the grind. 

And really, the retreats and the things that we are doing now is that manifestation of that dream that got tucked in my heart all those years ago, and how beautiful it is. And I'm really glad I actually found the article, he made me clean out the damn closet. 

But it was a reminder that you know, those things don't go away, those little dreams that you have, these visions that you have. And it might not be in this moment. But if it's a dream, and it's worth it, you'll find a way to pursue it. Like, your system will find a way to make it happen.

PATRICK CASALE: I love that. That's wonderful. And you know, I think neither of us take this for granted. Like, there's a lot of privilege in our ability to say we're going to go do these things and create these experiences. And that's why during these experiences we're also trying really hard to make some affordability built in for people who would not get to have them. And that really is important to both of us. So, you know, I think that's a good way for me to stay grounded and just, you know, assess my values, too. 

And we have a bunch of stuff coming up, like we just co-wrote a retreat planners, like manual that we're going to publish and-

JENNIFER AGEE: Yeah. 

PATRICK CASALE: Which is exciting as hell and what do we have this year? New Orleans, Spain, Asheville, and Portugal. So, it's pretty exciting to have cool, desirable places within our country and then cool, desirable international destinations that people can come and join us in. 

And you know, I think for those of you who are thinking, "Co-hosting, running things together, how does that work?" We are very different. And that's a good thing for this because Jen has spreadsheets for her spreadsheets. And I have all these like whimsical, romanticized ideas, and then we can come together and kind of find the middle ground, and it's really wonderful to be able to trust someone to support you with your aligned vision. 

And it's not always probably going to be easy because traveling is messy. And traveling can be painful. But it's such a beautiful thing to be able to do together and it's brought us really close as friends and colleagues, and it's just really exciting to see where the rest of the year or the next couple of years are going to go.

JENNIFER AGEE: I love what we do together so much. Because the responsibility is shared, I get to enjoy more. Because even though on the surface, honestly, I hear this from people all the time, "I just want to be able to do what you guys do and travel all the time." And it looks way more glamorous than what the behind-the-scenes actually is because there's a shit ton of work that goes into this. And not that it's not worth it, it's worth it. But there's a shit ton of work, and having that divide and conquer, and also sharing the financial risk and all of that, it's made this a lot more fun, without a doubt.

PATRICK CASALE: I agree. And I do think, you know, I so often talk about on this podcast, you know, the behind-the-scenes stuff because that's the important stuff, in my opinion, the messiness of it all. 

And, you know, just before we started recording, today, we were talking about logistics for New Orleans because I have been anxious about New Orleans coming out of surgery, for my throat surgery, and some other stuff. And it's just like, I want people to have a good experience that paid a lot of money. We need to, like, really make this, you know, happen for these folks. And it's very helpful to have Jennifer who's like, "Okay, I'm going to put this all in the spreadsheet, and we're going to look at it from this perspective." And, you know, it's very calming. 

But yeah, it's a lot of fun, but it is a lot of work. And I think if those of you are thinking about retreat planning, or hosting events, or summits or conferences, like it is very rewarding, but I don't think you're not going to be anxious until the event is over. And then maybe you're going to send the feedback surveys and you're going to be anxious again. 

I think the intentionality, and just wanting people to have a good experience, and get their money's worth, and get that value, and that scares me a bit about Ireland 2023. I'm like, "Can I duplicate what we did in 2022?" Like, that was so remarkably just amazing and powerful. And like, one thing could throw this off, you know? But ultimately, it's just a new group of people to get to share these experiences with and I really love that. 

So, I'm looking forward to what we've got to plan together. And we've got some cool stuffs in store for 2024. Jennifer and I are very fortunate enough and privileged enough, and lucky enough to go to Europe for a month this year to do recon for a retreat, and our partners are both somehow willing to just be like, "Go do it." And we are going to go check out Greece, and Italy, and southern Spain, and Portugal, and really have some cool stuff in store for everyone in 2024 as well.

JENNIFER AGEE: I cannot wait. Like, sometimes I just think I can't believe I get to live this life. Like, I don't take it for granted because I know life can change, you know, on a dime. But sometimes I do. I just have those moments where I think I'm really lucky and I am so freaking thankful. 

The other thing is you and I did marry the right partners, for sure. Because our partners both work for the federal government. They got like good consistent income with those federal benefits. Like, we definitely lucked out in the spouse department, for sure.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah, I agree. Ariel, I love you, thank you so much. 

JENNIFER AGEE: [PH 00:27:57] Farrell, I love you, too. 

PATRICK CASALE: It's a lot. And I think their support is helpful as well. And, you know, I want to just quickly talk about some options that we have that are still available for 2023, for those of you listening because, unfortunately, New Orleans, Ireland, and Spain are all sold out. Jennifer, I think you may still have spots for your Alaskan cruise in June?

JENNIFER AGEE: No, I don't.

PATRICK CASALE: That's sold out too, okay.

JENNIFER AGEE: That's sold. 

PATRICK CASALE: We have a retreat in Asheville, North Carolina in August, which is specifically for people who want to host and plan retreats. This is not for anyone who's like, "Hey, I'm considering it." It's like you know, you want to do it, you want to get your idea off the ground, you want to leave that experience, idea in hand mapped out, ready to go, ready to promote, ready to sell. 

And then we also have a marketing retreat in Portugal in October with a few spots left. And that's going to be specifically geared towards really cool creative ways to market your ideas, spend less time with your [INDISCERNIBLE 00:29:01] seat, spend less time doing clinical work, and just really trying to figure out cool, creative ways to market yourself without feeling like a sleazy car salesperson, and just being really authentically you, and just really tapping into the skills that you have, and highlighting them, and really putting them out to the world. 

So, we rented an entire farm in Portugal, 20 minutes outside of Lisbon, and we're going to go on day trips and do photo, music shows, and go to Sintra, and Jen really wants to see these amazing Moorish castles out there. So-

JENNIFER AGEE: Yes, I do all of that. 

PATRICK CASALE: We're going to do all that and all of our retreats offer [PH 00:29:37] NBC CCEs because we're helping professional development, and helping you grow, and helping you figure out the emotional side of being a mental health therapist and entrepreneur.

JENNIFER AGEE: One of the things I love about what we did with Portugal, specifically, when we both saw this location, you found it, and you shared it with me. Both of us had this vision of how cool this is going to be because not only are there private rooms, but there are enough of the shared spaces that we can make this very affordable for people who are new, who need to focus on marketing and, you know, want to start living these experiences and getting the opportunity to have that like in an affordable way. That's one of the things I really loved that we did with Portugal because we both had that in mind. As soon as we saw it, we knew that this would be the perfect opportunity for someone who was on a tighter budget to be able to do something like this.

PATRICK CASALE: Yeah. And that's really important when this is all said and done. And we do have BIPOC discounts as well because we really want to make sure those of you who don't have access to the same resources or advantages, who have marginalized identities are able to come on these events because we need you out there sharing your ideas, and we need you out there creating your visions and pursuing your goal. So, Portugal should be a blast. 

And then we've got some exciting news for 2024 that we're going to keep under wraps until we get it finalized. But it's been a hell of a journey. And it's only year one. So, I'm really excited to see where this goes.

JENNIFER AGEE: Yeah, me too. I can't wait. Y'all come join us on a retreat, I promise we're a lot of fun to hang out with.

PATRICK CASALE: We will happily take you around, and show you the local side of things and just really ensure that you feel like not only did you get your money's worth, but you came away with friends, connections, resources, and just a new outlook on things, some way to kind of jumpstart and re-energize your career. And it did that for me. And I really do believe in the power of travel. 

And I took this picture off my wall, which is a picture of Anthony Bourdain. He was probably one of my most inspiring human beings that was in my life as someone that I really, really looked up to. And the quote says, "Travel changes you. As you move through this life in this world you change things slightly, you leave marks behind however small, and in return life and travel leaves marks on you." And I agree with that 100%. And I just really buy into the power of movement, and travel, and new experience. 

And I hope that this was helpful for everyone. If you want to start a retreat, if you want to come on a retreat, please contact us. We're going to be doing a lot of these things together in 2023, 2024, and beyond. And really looking forward to everything this all has to offer. 

And Jennifer, just tell the audience where they can find more of what you offer because you do coaching and a bunch of other stuff that you've got going on, too.

JENNIFER AGEE: Yeah, my website is counselingcommunity.com. And I also run a podcast called Shit You Wish You Learned in Grad School, which is actually what I call it behind the scenes. So, that's why I titled the podcast that, but if you find the website, you'll find links to all the social media stuff as well.

PATRICK CASALE: And again, Jen excels at the strategic thinking, and planning, and just structural stuff that a lot of our brains just don't do well with. I promise you if you need guidance with any of that, and you need someone who can help you think bigger and grow, highly recommend Jennifer for coaching. And she's also on all the social media channels too. 

For myself, you can go to allthingspractice.com and the All Things Private Practice Podcast comes out every Sunday morning. Like, download, subscribe, and share. It's on all major platforms. Doubt yourself, do it anyway. Join us in Asheville or Portugal and I will see you next week. Thanks, Jen. 

JENNIFER AGEE: Bye, thank you.